why are so many on this site afraid of fruit?
Hi, Kelly. I was wondering what you use for protection against the sun. I quit using sunscreen a year ago, but I still get burnt. I put pure aloe vera from a plant on my burns and it helps a lot. I just started the raw diet a couple weeks ago. And before that I was on the SAD diet. I cut out dairy, meat, poultry, fish, all in the same week. I still am not strictly 100 percent raw but I am working on it. Also I am trying to use organic skin care products, if I do use them I use very little. I need gel for my hair and shaving cream so I can shave but I use all organic stuff. I used to be 155 pounds on the SAD diet. I am now 140. I am 5'11" and 21 years old. I used to go to the gym a lot and eat lots of protein powder. But I quit doing that and lost lots of weight. I feel better at 150 but can't seem to keep my weight there. Also I just stepped on the scale and I am now 138. So, what can I eat to get my weight up? All I have been eating are fruit and veggies. Also some nuts.
hi brandon! i'm not an expert but i'll give you as much advice as i can! ever since i started eating healthy, i rarely burn and tan really easy. when i ate unhealthy, i burned and freckled and went back to white. if you burn easily, i would recommend going out in the sun everyday starting around 15 min and then keep adding more time as you build a tolerance. as you continue the diet, you will have more of a tolerance.
you will have detox symptoms while your body is adjusting to the new diet and cleansing out all the old toxins. welcome them, they are good signs that your body is healing itself! weight loss is definitely normal as your body is releasing toxins. toxins get stored in your muslces, tissues, fat, organs etc. so when they're getting released you are bound to lose some weight. after the whole detox process your weight will return to normal as long as you are eating enough fruits and veggies. a short water fast will speed up the detox process. if you choose to do a water fast i really really recommend reading up on it first so you can know what to expect. any fasting book by herbert shelton or t.c. fry is great. also, don't overeat. eat when you are hungry and don't eat past fullness. rest a lot during your transition, it will free up your bodies energy so that it can work on healing and cleansing. sleeping around 10 hours every night helps a lot! taking naps helps too. although resting is really important, you should still get some exercise.
i recommend reading up on natural hygiene so you can become more familiar with your body and it's processes. when i first tried the diet i asked a lot of questions on the forums because i didn't have the money to buy the books, but no one can give you all the great information like the books can! if funds are tight try the used books on amazon.
here's some great books:
your natural diet: alive and raw foods by david klein and t.c. fry
any health book by herbert shelton, especially natural hygiene: man's pristine way of life
the 80/10/10 diet by doug graham
the china study- t. colin campbell
the basic health library volumes I, II, and III are a bunch of books by different natural hygienists compiled together, they're fantastic!
here's some tips for homemade products if you want to give it a try:
i used to use coconut oil in place of shaving cream and that worked pretty well. i just use water now and it's sufficient for me. there's some recipes for flax seed hair gel. i've used it before, it works really good! you boil a few teaspoons in about a half a cup of water and strain. if it's not thick enough after a few minutes add more flax seeds. keep in the fridge when you're not using and it will last longer.
bravo for taking care of your health! it sounds like you're already doing great!
hello. What do you eat or cut out from a lot-fat raw diet? I'm trying to lose some weight.
hi! you eat less than 10% of your calories from fat. you can still eat avocado, nuts and seeds, etc. if you desire but you shouldn't eat more than 10% of your calories from them. eat a ton of sweet fruits and some non-sweet fruits like zucchini, cucumber, bell pepper, etc. with the addition of greens like celery and lettuce.
Thank you so much. I have a dance recital it a few weeks and want to look great. So I wasn't sure what I should do to lose weight.
you're welcome! i would exercise a bunch too. jogging for 10-30 min per day with short intervals of sprinting will burn fat. you have to do it in the morning on an empty stomach for it to be really effective though. and don't worry, your body stores enough glucose from the previous day so you'll have plenty of energy. hope this helps!
Thank you! I'm a tap dancer and don't want to bulk up. So any other exercise's I should do? If I jog on my rebounder would I get the same results? I've fallen off the wagon and gained the weight I've lost eating raw and feel really crappy. Thanks again!
p.s. if anyone else has any ideas that would be great! I have a little less than 3 weeks to do this.
Kelly, that's very interesting what you say about running first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. I havent heard that before. I current do quite a bit of (interval) running and am skinny all over except for my stomach, which still has a bit of a tire. Been trying to target this area with pilates but think the amount of fat I'm eating is not helping. I checked my %'s on fitday and found that I eat around 35% fat which I think must be too high. Just one tablespoon of olive oil along with my sunflower seed pate really ups the %. Think I'm going to start looking for oil free salad dressings. Any suggestions?
sv3 I often use just the juice of a lime, or lemon, or a few wedges of an orange, for salad dressing. Also, tomato blended with mango and a bit of lime (& if you use them: shallot/onion, and maybe garlic, added in) is really good.
My new favorite salad dressing is also lime juice. Two years ago I would never have believed lime juice could taste so good on a salad. If lime isn't available, my second choice is orange juice. Some of my fellow teachers seem to think I've gone a little wacko. If they only knew how good it really is . . .
I just wanted to say that while I believe some 80-10-10 people are pushy/do not subscribe to "live and let live," I think Kelly's posts have been nothing but respectful and helpful.
Kelly, I always run on an empty stomach too. Definitely feels waaay better.
But I disagree with you on the B-12 issue. You may feel great for years without supplementing but many vegans become so deficient down the road that they can actually die from it. I would highly recommend taking B-12 and even zinc. Don't just take pills though, so true about the expensive pee. Take either sub lingual or liquid. That way you can be sure about absorption.
thank you superfood2!!!!
sv3- it really is surprising when you log it in huh! any oil is 100% fat so that will add a lot. after not using any salt or spices for a while you start to appreciate the taste of plain lettuce, especially when your body really wants it. when i first started the diet i would blend up blood oranges or tangerines and throw it over the salad. if you don't want anything sweet you can chop up a tomato with a little fresh cilantro. i don't have very many ideas, i'll try to come up with more :)
I agree with Superfood. I just read this entire post and def do not feel that Kelly in anyway has been pushy or anything but respectful as opposed to some other 8/1/1 posts i have encountered. Although I do not follow 8/1/1, I def. dont think i am educated enough on it to make a decision. Personally I love fruit. I tend to have a green juice in the am and then as much fruit as i want through out the day. Dinner I tend to have a salad, but only if i am not craving fruit anymore, since once i eat a salad its no more fruit for me! (which i have to admit was shocked about, because i used to eat fruit for dessert all the time- learn something new everyday!)
Kelly- how does green lemonaide (romaine head, 5 sprigs of kale, green apple, whole lemon) affect you on the 8/1/1 diet?
I've never heard of "many vegans" becoming deficient in B12 and especially later dying. Most probably have better levels than omnivores, considering they are mindful to supplement, whereas some omnis haven't even heard of B12.
haha. very true. When i moved from NY to NC, i was majorly depressed and of course had a major eating issue. When i couldnt stand to look at myself anymore, (i was like 219) i went to a weight specialist, and got lots of exercise. This "weight" specialist put me on Phentermine, which i admit did work, (i have maintained my 160ish for two years) at this point in time, i dont even think i heard anything about Raw foods. They used to give me shots of B12 every week to give me an increase of energy to exercise... point of the story- people looked at me crazy wanting to know what a B12 shot was. Seriously? I may have been on a major SAD but i still knew about B12, and B6, etc. etc.
I think it is going to be different for every person that embarqs on a raw lifestyle, based on what type of foods you eat. Some may need to supplement, some may not. Some may do it because they think they should or it makes them feel better.
lobo- thanks! sounds like you're really doing good! it's definitely smart to eat all the sweet fruit you want and then eat veggies later. putting fruits on top of veggies will cause the fruits to ferment. i don't drink or eat lemons anymore, haven't had any desire for them. the greens i've been craving lately are celery and lettuce. i sometimes eat them plain or wrap a banana with lettuce or i will blend up lettuce or celery with bananas. i've also been eating a lot of english cucumbers lately, plain or with bananas. that's usually how i get my greens.
More links for anyone interested in Vitamin B-12. These are from "Vegan Outreach" and have sited sources (good to know where they are getting their info).
Superfood-It is possible to die from a deficiency in B-12. If you're deficient for a long period of time (probably over twenty years) the nerve and blood cell damage can lead to death. This isn't only a problem for vegans and vegetarians and unless you eat alot of beef and fish you can't get enough of it. I think it's really important to have an open mind about supplementing it because it's a very dangerous thing to be blind about it. I think you plan on being a vegan for your entire life because of your strong convictions and I think that's wonderful but in that time you can become deficient(I'm not just talking about the meat markets version of deficient but when your body actually can't function anymore) so please consider looking into it.
Sounds like most of the earth's population should be deficient? "...unless you eat a lot of beef and fish" - doesn't apply for most of the earth's population.
...I think it's a good idea to look at real life examples, who's healthy and energetic, who isn't. Take Storm Talifero, been 100 % raw for 35+ years and he definitely doesn't look like the sick type to me. Then again, he does use bee products but definitely not "a lot of beef and fish". A bit of honey and bee pollen here and there.
Jangreen: I could get real deep into archaeology and human history, it happens to be one of my absolute favorite subjects, but I guess this board is ill suited for that as it would involve too much non-vegan issues (I've been trashed on other vegan boards for bringing up the subject so I've become careful). Suffice to say whatever we've been eating for the past 20,000 years has with extremely high probability been there for way too short a time to affect our genes in any major way. To take an example, the skin color of homo sapiens changed lightning fast when we left Africa - in just around 1,000 generations, we went from all African black to something like modern peoples in Mid-East/North Africa. That's real blazing fast for evolution, rocket speed! This was because our ancestors were dying at a very young age of vitamin D deprivation, they didn't get old enough to have children - or if they did, only those children survived who, thanks to natural mutation, happened to have the lightest skin color.
An adaptation to food items previously unknown to man would take a lot longer. We would more likely talk about hundreds of thousands of years rather than tens of thousands. All depends on selective (evolutionary) pressure - the higher it is (the less children surviving without genetic mutations), the faster the genetic change necessary to adapt to the new conditions will happen. There is no doubt that fruit & veggies are our oldest diet; I will not use this board to go in length into my personal opinions when it comes to the adaptation of homo sapiens to sea food, meat and cooked roots but I'll always be happy to discuss the subject by e-mail, PM or on a non-vegan forum. I'll just add that based on scientific evidence and real-life experience, I do think homo sapiens can thrive on a diet including other than strictly vegan foods. But like I said, that's best discussed somewhere else. For me, environmental reasons are enough to stay vegan.
Troubles, I think Kelly is one who doesn't want to supplement B12; I do, and have always on this site and others advocated that I think everyone, including omnivores, use a sublingual methylcobalamin. I don't know why you think I didn't know about B12? My statement was that I don't think deficiency is common in vegans, no. 1, and no 2, that it occurs in omnivores, especially elderly. Of course people can die from deficiency, but you said "many vegans" are deficient and die....that's my problem with your statement. It's entirely inaccurate.
superfood-haha okay, I must have totally misunderstood you. So sorry. I didn't mean to come off sounding judgmental. I realize that Kelly doesn't want to supplement and I totally understand that because for quite a while I didn't. But I just wanted to bring to light that issue. That's all.
JA- Storm Talifero might be happy and healthy but probably is taking B-12.
No, Storm is very specific about not taking any supplements. He says it here (http://chidiet.com/news/storm.htm), for example (the message itself has nothing with supplements to do but he mentions it). The entire family lives without any supplements.
Personally I can't see we were created to need supplements. They came along a few decades ago, how come mankind survived a few millions of years without supplements ;) I also don't think we must have supplements regardless of the damage done to the soil by modern society etc. as long as we eat mainly organic and preferably some wild produce too.
Troubles, no problem! I would agree with you that maybe a few vegans (or people in general, even omnis) have died from a B12 deficiency, but not "many"!
i have to agree with JA on this one. not trying to convince anyone to quit their b12 supplement, but I think this is a great debate. why would we be created to have to rely on supplements? we were born with no tools for extracting vitamins and minerals. in the wild you wouldn't carry around a bottle of b12 supplement. we have the physiology of a frugivore. we do not have a physiology of a meat eater, so that means we were designed to eat fruit and greens. we would not be designed to eat fruit and greens and then not given the capabilities to meet all our vitamin and mineral needs. besides, meat eaters have the same problem, it is not a vegan or vegetarian issue. meat eaters have a harder time with absorption.
we get everything we need from a natural diet of raw fruits and greens, the sun, and our bodies. if you eat 100% raw plant foods then your absorption will be far better than that of a SAD dieter. if you are not eating a healthy vegan diet of plant foods, then you should be supplementing, because your absorption will not be as good as a person that eats 100% raw plant foods.
does anyone really know a specific person that really died from b12 deficiency, like they were tested and had no other health problems that contributed to their death besides that?
Just to add some thoughts to the debate on B-12. Some possibilities on why "we" may need supplements, and our ancestors did not.
Our ancestors very well may have needed supplements. They wouldn't have had blood tests to tell them. Though, even if you look back a few generations you will hear of people failing to thrive, dying from strange named wasting diseases, etc. Who is to say that those people may not have had B-12 issues (and they most likely where eating meat and dairy)
Life spans were shorter long ago. Life was short and brutal. Food wasn't always abundant. Childbirth was much more dangerous, infant mortality high. If people had B12 problems, they probably had more immediate problems like "what am I going to eat today" to worry about. If there was fresh fruit and veggies, they ate them. If not, and they where hungery enough, maybe that's why people started eating meat? At least where I live (Ohio- cold winters), there is no way (that I can think of) that people actually followed "our" style of diet long ago. Where I live, the best indication of what people ate long ago would have been who we now call Native Americas. They ate deer and buffalo, and the local vegetables and fruits.
They would have starved otherwise. I'm NOT advocating meat eating (I'm vegetarian, half ways vegan), just pointing out that I don't think there is a lot of evidence to say that all our ancestors ate raw vegan diets. Maybe in tropical areas (just like our closer vegetarian primate animals)?
Long ago (even just go back several hundred years)- sanitation wasn't what it is today. People where more likely to get diseases from contaminated water. But, they may have also been getting their B-12 from the contaminated water (assuming contamination came from feces). I recall seeing an article (maybe someone else has) stating that there is a theory why people in the slums of India do not have B-12 issues (contaminated water).
I personally feel following a high fruit, plenty of greens, and low fat high raw diet is working very well for me. I also believe that there are good arguments for being vegan- medical, ethical, and environmental.
I just question whether there is a good evidence that long ago that's how everyone ate, and they where healthier and lived longer. I don't believe there is any evidence of cultures being completely raw vegan (or any kind of raw).
I still believe it's good for me, and others. But, I don't know if we should look towards our ancestors or our physiology to justify our choice. No, we don't have claws and long teeth. But, we have tool (and weapon) making abilities. One on one, a human can't take down most prey. Guns, spears and such make it possible. For me, that kind of kills the physiology theory. I never use it when someone asks why I don't eat meat. (Plus, people who are concerned about not eating meat will point out our canine teeth.)
Just some thoughts. Hopefully they came out sounding respecful and I don't mean to upset anyone. Just to add some different ideas.